Thursday, September 18, 2008


Interesting question about the blog came in private e-mail from someone who wishes to remain nameless.

"You state that a lot of people have had the abyss experience. Does this mean that you think lots of people have attained K&C of their HGA as well? It stands to reason, that an experience that happens in Tiphareth would have to occur before an experience in Daath"

My answer is no. I do not think as many people have attained the K&C of the HGA as have "crossed the abyss". Just for clarification I do not people that have stabilized their trans-abyssal consciousness. I mean merely those that have had the experience itself. Sort of like visiting Spain, but not moving there.

One is not dependent upon the other. The K&C of the HGA is very specific to certain systems of magick. The "abyss experience" is a lot more universal to mystics and magicians the world over. In my own experience the HGA is harder to attain, but easier to stabilize. The Abyss is easier to attain, but much harder to stabilize.

Note that Crowley seems to have picked up on this stating that one could take the Oath of the Abyss even as a beginner.

If you are following a graduated system based upon the tree like that of the GD and AA than yes you should attain the K&C of the HGA first, but that doesnt mean that it must be done that way in all cases.

Don't forget that the menu is not the meal.


Frater BH said...

I always find your point of view very interesting. Thanks for keeping up your blog while under that deadline. I am not quite sure how you do that.

Persephone said...

I agree with Frater BH... we appreciate the posts!

This makes perfect sense to me. It's sorta like knowing where all of your missing socks are, but not having any way to get to that place or bring the socks back into your everyday life.
Fascinating vision... but still, no matching socks.


yemeth said...

From my perspective, the problem is that "The Abyss" is usually misinterpreted. You can read that Crowley speaks of an "outermost Abyss", and that should bring a clue.

Usually the first strong Initiation into magick isn't spoke about, or confused with "The Abyss". This first Initiation would be what Dion Fortune considers the "Vision of the Angel" in Malkuth and deals with delusion and the breakdown of ideas about reality, which leads to the first contact with the Holy Guardian Angel which dwells between the lines in the symbolic level. Such Angel would then proceed to lead you to its K&C, but -I agree- this would need a big effort from you.

As far as I know, after K&C you would be led to that famous "The Abyss", which I guess is quite different to the first abyss in Malkuth (or in the Tav path between Malkuth and Yesod, depending on the author), but which seems to deal with illusion as well.